Coship 3188C Open letter to Sat Facts

[Roy Carman]

Hello Bob.

I have just read your "Sign Off" in the latest Sat Facts.

If Peter Escher is receiving the "end of the line" Coships, as is your thoughts, then can I ask as to why the ones he is now selling, and selling very well into Europe have a new face upon them and the added bonus of an UHF Modulator that can be switched to any PAL system in the World.

I ask, would a manufacturer who intends to stop making such a receiver, make it even better? Give Coship an order for 400 receivers of the 3188C and they will do a "Factory Run". This is from the factory, not an off the cuff comment dreamed up by some so called expert.

Also why do you in your receiver listings list the Coship 3188C as "Buy with Caution". Is there more to this than meets the eye, and I do not mean from the Coship end, I mean with you. I would tread very warily as your anti-Coship articles could be considered to be libellous.

The real question is "Why is there not anyone prepared to sell these in Europe?"

Could this also be something to do with DMSi in the USA?

The reason, and for some obscure reason you do not state it, yet you publish a "screen" in your "Sign Off" saying Coship sold out.

You know full well the reason for the Coship being sold out and that is DMSi have the sole right of importing these receivers into the USA. DMSi have manipulated the "non availability" in the USA and therefore Europe, to promote the awful Satwork.

Or is it you are also angling the "users" toward Satwork so that you can sell them? It is my deduction from your writings, that the real reason why you are peeved with me, and that is this; you intended to be the sole agent for Satwork in the Antipodes and my writing the "Awful Satwork" report has virtually killed the Satwork at birth.

I suggest that Tim Heinrichs or someone in his forward organisation, some where along the line has been economical with the truth, and we were set up with the thought implanted in our mind that if we wanted to continue down the blind search path we would have to buy the darned awful Satwork.

You scorned me with a fair amount of vitriol, in the September Sat Facts, for killing the Satwork and so upsetting the forward thinking and planning path of DMSi.

The truth of the matter is that DMSi had absolutely nothing to do with the design of, or software, of the Coship, they merely stumbled upon it because they were selling Coship at that time. They then designed one for themselves around another processor that would do the same job. The Coship using the Fujitshu processor, the Satwork I believe to be using the ST 5518 processor.

The proof of this can be seen by the amount of software "up-dates" that are pouring onto DMSi world wide web sites for the Satwork, yet none for the Coship.

The rest of the story from DMSi could and probably is just a well organised and phased marketing ploy.Is there really a contract for 60,000 for the Middle East?

The unavailability of processors came to me direct from the USA, and I passed that snippet to Roger Bunney. It was also implied in a previous "Sign Off" one edition ago, August edition.

Also it was me who was trying to persuade a dealer friend of mine to take on the Coship/Satwork. Once my dealer friend discovered that this would mean importing from the USA and that he could not buy direct from China he resolved not to get involved. As it turns out, how right he was. Heinrichs even approached me, but by that time , although tempted, I had my suspicions as to what was really going on, again my suspicions have been well borne out. It was nothing like you have implied in Octobers "Sign Off".

So although Roger published this in Television, I am the responsible person for him doing so. Therefore I ask that you put the record straight. The decent thing would be to publish the whole of this missive, as anything other than would not convey the real truth.

The real truth of the matter is, and that is blind search is here to stay. Hopefully it will not go the way of the now ageing Nokias.

I see it as the future for all receivers.

By its pure simplicity it makes it easy for any one with the smallest amount of knowledge, to tune their receiver and keep it up to date with both Channel and Transponder changes.

This is absolutely vital in the crowded skies over Europe where one group of Satellites alone produces very nearly 900 TV Channels.

I am now in contact direct with a manufacturer of blind search receivers. This guy is prepared to listen, and by doing so improve their range of "blind search" receivers so that the whole World can make use and enjoy satellite television.

It is a good job that I have learned through past bitter experience not to believe everything written in the papers, magazines etc, a long, long time ago.

Honesty is becoming a rare commodity in today's "Profit before People, World".

That is why satellite receiver manufacturers, dealers and magazines hate me, because I try to tell the truth and be honest.

The words, "I won't send you a receiver because I know I won't sell many more once you have written about it" has become my badge of honour.

There is a lot of garbage out there, both manufactured and written. I have taken it as my mission in my late life to try to put the record straight.

Thank God for the www. It has made the truth more accessible to the common man

Yours............Roy.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
:mad:

[theslydog]

Vetruns little forum is graced with the presence of Roy 'the legend' Carman.

Hi Roy
I have been reading about this in a few places on the net. A lot of folks here are looking to get a Coship because of the true auto search function it has.

I did not realise the extent to the bitching and back stabbing that was going on over this receiver. But to be honest it does not surprise me.

The same thing goes on here in Australia. Just talk to any local satellite product retailler about the Hotchip verses everybody else in the undercutting market wars.

tsd

[Roy Carman]

Many thanks for your message vertrun.

I attached a message I launched into Europe last night.



---- Original Message -----
From: ROY CARMAN
To: Feedhunters ; sat_dx@yahoogroups.com ; Satellite Mad ; satellite-europe@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 22, 2003 6:56 PM
Subject: OT:-New Blind Search Receiver.


Hi All.

Before I write anything, I must express my sincere thanks to Tony Daly who trawled the web to find this exciting receiver.

This is a second generation blind search receiver, but again the Chinese do not appear to understand just how many satellites and therefore channels litter the skies over Europe.

With only the capability to store 1000 channels it is nigh on useless for the standard satellite viewer. For a start it will not handle Hotbird at all at 13 East.

It will find easily 91 working transponders on Hotbird, but instead of downloading any channels it defaults to the menu and you have downloaded absolutely nothing at all.

It took just twelve minutes to search the whole of Hotbird., but what's the point.

Major issue over and looking at it as a DXing receiver, it is then it comes into its own.

It is fast and it is furious. Also the receiver is loaded with nearly every satellite out there, and those that are not listed you can rename one of those that you cannot see for one that you can see.

Again the receiver in its results does not supply the FEC.

Menus can be read in most major European languages.

The best bit is, it actually has Scart sockets on the rear, yes two of them, as well as two sets of RCA sockets. But there isn't any SVHS takeoff, nor digital audio out.

An IF loop through and also a UHF Modulator that can be switched to all the PAL systems.

For those locked in the past or using C Band, Skew is provided for, as is a twelve volt accessory socket.

Picture and Audio I find to be excellent.

Threshold is far better than that of the Coship.

Where these are going to be on sale is yet an unanswered question.

To answer a question as to why no one wants to sell these receivers in Europe is because any receiver being sold within the EU has to CE graded, and getting that grading can cost an importer and distributor one hell of a lot of money. Anyone importing them and selling them as grey imports could and possibly will find themselves in a lot of trouble.

I shall be writing a full report about it later. So please hold your questions until you have read the full report.

Also remember that you won't suffer the economical with the truth type of report that you get from the magazines, especially What Satellite TV and Digital, who's management appears to support the stance of "Profit before People" and back an Editor whom is a stranger to truth as well as being duplicitous.

You have been warned.

Yours.................Roy.

The penultimate paragraph illustrates well the problems we also suffer in Europe.

Yours..........Roy.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Also remember

[Apsattv]

Roy you are talking about the INNOVIA? correct?

Does it not have the ability to delete all transponders off a particular satellite?

Surely it has an add transponder option in a menu somewhere? and also a delete option?

But only holding 1000 channels? I thought the specs of the Innovia said it will do 3000. Hmmm

Mind you we would drool over 89 transponders...lets not even comment on "1000" channels
:rolleyes: :mad:

[Roy Carman]

Hi Apsattv.

Yes it is the Inovia.

And a real odd receiver this is turning out to be.

I don't want to say to much at this point, but all I have managed to get the receiver to hold is 593 TV and 514 radio.

I ahve tried it again on Hotbird, after down loading approximately 900 channels from Astra 1. It searched out this time 95 TPs but would only download those to the 1100 channel limit.

Not much good up here in Europe where we have three of these large satellite constellations.

Going to remove all TPs etc this time and see if that improve storage capacity.

Yours.......Roy.

[Yalickit]

Roy,

Welcome to the forum, I am wondering why everyone is going on about the coship? It seems the sponsor here promotes a simliar item that beackons to be better and do a lot more.

Maybe you could review the link and give us your feedback.

http://www.adigitalife.com/product_info.php?product_id=82&cat_link=digital_satellite.html&resultpage=1

[Roy Carman]

Hi Yalickit.

Thanks for the welcome.

Yes this is a clone of the Inovia that I am just finishing a report on.

The first thing anyone should do is use the "User's Manual" out in the dunny, (Thats what you guys call it I believe.) Because that is all it is fit for. The sad thing is I have seen worse.

Korean translated by a Dutchman into English. The mind boggles.

Why they need to clone things I do not know. It all adds to confusion.

Looking at the construction of the Inovia and the dreadful Satwork 3618 they are also the same receiver, but this time in a different box.

I am going to attempt to transfer data from the Inovia to the Satwork. If it works OK then I would have rescued a crap receiver from going to the garbage dump.

Yours............Roy.

[aDigitaLife.com]

We would like to inform the viewing public, the Powtek is NOT a clone of Innovia.

The Powtek is manufactured by the owners of the Powtek brand under OEM. The manufacturers own the brand Powtek.

I suggest to you Roy, the Innovia is a clone of Powtek. Not the other way around.

Kind Regards

The Team @ aDigitalife

[bassett]

I read your encounter with Mr Cooper, with great intrest,, And I say to you with the greatest respect to yourself,,, You Sir are waisting your time and energy and talant, even attempting to discuss anything with Mr Cooper..

Mr Cooper lives in a time warp of 1974, and will never progress any further.

Mr Coopers opinion, must never be challanged, as he is the
Pioneer of home satellite television. And HE knows everything, simply because he discovered everything first,, And has never progressed past that point..

Some years ago I dared to criticize his magazine "Satfacts". I simply asked the question , "When was he going to go back to discussing satellite related topic's, and resume giving Receiver Test reports.. He asked the Golden question,, "What did I consider wrong with Satfacts"
Over the following weekend a few of us dicected, and basicly
took apart 5 years of satfacts magazines, We where not distructive, but constructive, and produced a 25 page report on how "Satfacts" could be improved. We also listed the decline
in satellite related topic,s over the years,, and dared to ask the question, Why one of his advertisers had used the same page for
5 years of issues. Without one single change.

The result was that one week later, my subscription to his magazine was cancelled, never to be returned. Simply because
he did not consider our recomendations constructive..
Many of our recomendations , where used my MR Cooper,
over the following years. But we did not recomend that he employ a convicted criminal to write about pirate related topic's

I would suggest that you not waste your valuable time with this man, as you will never win, or indeed be allowed to voice your opinion, as he will simply move the goal posts..

bassett

[Apsattv]

Originally posted by aDigitaLife.com
We would like to inform the viewing public, the Powtek is NOT a clone of Innovia.

The Powtek is manufactured by the owners of the Powtek brand under OEM. The manufacturers own the brand Powtek.

I suggest to you Roy, the Innovia is a clone of Powtek. Not the other way around.

Kind Regards

The Team @ aDigitalife

Who can tell and does it really matter? I think the specs are the same with many boxes using the same components CPU etc. Only thing uniqe is the actual receievers case design, Front Panel..

What sets them apart is the onboard software this can make or break a reciever. The hardwares fine on most low end receivers these days.

It will be interesting to hear if Roy can upload the innovias software into that other receiver.

[knucklehead]

It seems there are a lot of people out there who have had a lot of negative experiences with Mr Cooper. Me as well, although I cancelled my subscription before he did. As he is obviously completely irrelevant in today's sat scene, why don't we all ignore the loudmouth and he will probably go away.

[Liam]

Im sure it would be possible for you guys out there who seem to know just about evrything to do with FTA, satellite tv etc to produce your own mag.. sounds like there is a need for a decent one!!
(i havent read satfacts by the way)

[vetrun]

Welcome to the site Roy.

I don't understand what all the bashing of the coship is about, for a cheap blind search receiver from what I have heard seems to do a good job. The only thing I don't like about it is that it doesn't support Diseqc 1.2. Then again, for the price it is a bargain and it would be good for a second box just for scanning.


@liam

I feel there isn't really any reason for a mag anymore due to the internet. By using Craigs site (apsattv.com) and this site you get up to date news in this region without having to wait for the next mag. If anyone wants to write any articles about anyting sattv related feel free to post it here.

Click on the satfacts link at www.apsattv.com an you can get a sample copy if you like. I got a sample copy a while ago but I didn't think it was anything special. Your better off using the internet to get good sattv infomation. Anyway, thats just my opinion, I could be wrong. :confused:


vetrun

[Roy Carman]

Hi All.

Getting colder up here.

I have written a report on the Inovia but it is to big to get onto this forum.

I have also had a reply from the facory about my report.

Can I send it to someone to get it pasted onto here.

I also have written a report about the dreadful Satwork.

(Theres Bob "Sad Facts" pulling his shoulders in trying to hide in a beer bottle again. Guess what he wouldn't publish it, in fact he asked me to change it. So much for honesty in the satellite press. Editors are the same up here, our What Satellite TV and digital editor is a duplicitous stranger to the truth)

I also have several passages about feed hunting.

Vetrun if you can contact me direct, or any interested parties. My email is r.carman@ntlworld.com

Yours...Roy

Yours..........Roy.

[Apsattv]

Send them top me I will publish on my sites Articles section

[bassett]

But will you print the item in its entirety, without any editing, Craig,,, Considering you support Cooper, by allowing him space on your site,,
I really think it's about time you got off the fence..:mad: :mad:

[Apsattv]

I have no association with Coship or Satworks why would I edit Roys reviews??

And just because Bob supplys a page for my site dosn't mean I agree with everything he writes.

[Apsattv]

Articles section has been added at apsattv.com

If you can't see it listed hold down ctrl and click refresh in your browser.

Innovia review is up and the Satwork and Co-ship ones will be as well as soon as I have converted them.

and NO bassett no editing was done other than correcting the Spelling of Innovia and moving a block of text near the top.
:cool:

[theslydog]

I was interested in Roys reply from the Company that makes the Innovia.

They are going to try to put the suggestions Roy made in the review into the next software update esp the FEC.

Also bring out a new model with more Flash IC memory for storing more channels.

Should make an interesting box with these upgrades.

tsd

[Roy Carman]

Whoops silly me spelt the name wrongly.

It's nice to see that the problem exists also in the Southern Hemisphere in that you drop a small spherical object and some one jumps on it with unassumed smart assed glee. Only up here it is usually guys who never help others who jump on you.



Addendum as at Sunday 25 October 2003.

I did not solve the problem of the password of the “System Version” in the Parental Control sub menu.

Tony Daly a fellow Innovia conspirator who lives in Eire has solved the mystery of the need for a password to view the “System Version”.

He discovered that this does other things than display the hardware and the current software version.

On entering 8888 as the password the receiver not only displays the current version data but also throws the receiver into a factory reset so loosing all your previously found data.

Not only do you loose your data but the “Search Menu defaults as well to one for Asia. The Satellites that now appear are 001…Asia Sat 2R, 002….Asia Sat 2, 003…SINOSAT, 004….SAT 4, 005…SAT 5 etc.

Transponders that are in the software can be removed in the same manner as I have mentioned elsewhere in the report.

Also you are required to go into the “Satellite Menu” (Go to the Channel Search part of the main menu, press OK, the screen changes to one that is headed by the Satellite name, depress OK again, and the LNB type can adjusted.) and change the LNB to the required one that is in use. Here in the Northern Hemisphere this would more than likely be to “Universal”.

To move the receiver back to Hotbird etc, you do not repeat the procedure of going through the “System Version”, all you need to do is go back to Parental Control Menu and carry out a normal “Factory Restore”.

End of Addendum.

[aDigitaLife.com]

Roy,

Your quote, "This receiver is also marketed as the Powtek." Is completly WRONG.

http://www.apsattv.com/articles/Innovia-IDS3088Sreview.htm

I have attached photo's of your tested product the "Innovia" and of the "POWTEK". The Innovia photo's were taken from Innovia's website and the Powtek photos we took ourselves.

Your review describes a completely different STB to the Powtek

You will notice changes in overall on the back, from connections right down to the mounting screws-Please use your eyes and take note.(Too many to list) You will also notice the front is different with front operational buttons.

You will also notice overall size is different. The POWTEK is smaller .

Specs for Innovia Size (W×H×D) 340×70×230 mm

Specs for the Powtek

W 255 mm
H 60 mm
D 230 mm


You claim your Innovia could not hold significant channels due to a small memory is a complete contrary to the Powtek

We used 4 Dishs to load every single possible TV and radio channel from Intelsat 1701, Optus C1, Pas 8, Pas2, Optus B1, Asiasat 2. plus all pre-exisiting factory satellite information.(You may count the channels). Using it for both C and KU band. We used DiSEqC only for all this.

We will let readers know that your review is in no way a reflection of the POWTEK, we did NOT experience any problems with the software unlike your Innovia.

The Powtek does NOT have games as your Innovia does,
The Powtek has favourites unlike your Innovia.
The Powtek has 8 changable OSD unlike your Innovia.

I could name many more differences, right down to power supply input. The POWTEK is not Innovia.

Roy, you claimed in a previous post you "have a life mission", may we suggest you review it first before posting incorrect satellite reviews.

[Roy Carman]

I stand corrected by your superior attitude, sorry knowledge, and therefore will remove the Powtek comment.

Again the critic stikes. They sit on their arses saying nothing , keeping their little secrets to themselves, reveling in their superior knowledge, doing nothing telling no-one.

An error is made, and I stand corrected on that point because I do own up to my mistakes, but I was going on information given by a third party which was obviously incorrect.

But do they attempt to write a review so that we can all learn, no they don't. The southern hemisphere suffers the same problem as the north.

Obviously a Bob Cooper fan by the way the rebuke is written.

Yours............Roy.

[Roy Carman]

Have removed all reference to Powtek from the article.

What about sending me one to test and write a review about please.

Yours.........Roy Carman.

[viewer]

Hi guys,

Well...this is a lively debate, and great reading. Just sitting "on the fence" watching the to and froi is mindboggling. This has to be the best debate seen on receivers, in my time on the net with sat gear, and thats about 7 years.....thanks for the read.

I don't suppose any of these manufacturers are also considering a blind searchers that also has UCAS support and PVR capabilities is there??? If anyone can produce a cheap base box that can do this, and it's software is related to our region ( ie transponders/sats/menu's), then we will have all we need.

Once again...thanks for a great thread...I'm enjoying this one !!.
:D :D

[Apsattv]

No problem I have removed The Powtek clone comment from Roy's review and reuploaded the modified page and file to my site.

Digitalife how about you send Roy one to review or at least send him the source so that he can import one for his testing.

Oh and what do we have here?

Is it a clone of the Satwork? or maybe a rebadged Powtek??

http://www.wsidigital.com/goldsat.htm

and don't rule out the fact Front panels and back panels on recievers inputs output on back panels ARE usually factory OPTIONAL items, for example Scarts on Innovia are a factory option...

Pop the top off and you may find the same innards!

Anyway i will end by saying today I was told that the Coship 3188C is about to be upgraded as well with more memory improved software, twin scarts..........may pay to hold off grabbing one of the older ones.

[horst]

from horst
what small minded comments i see on this page-
i like satfacts the way it is-not withstanding
i subscribe to other magazines as well-
but why attac it ?
it makes for good short and exact reading-
my only complained is the slow delivery from
sydney-samtimes 5 days-
this is my little comment on this subject
h_strecker@bigpond.com;) ;)

[bassett]

With due respect "Horst" You obvously have not been around long enough to understand the situation regarding "Crapfacts" magazine.
Where would you like me to start,, random editing, misdirected facts, Employing known hackers, misinformation on receivers,
advertising that never changed in 5 years.. The degrading of a brand of receiver simply because the main importer withdrew advertising..
Will I go on,,, Nurrr,, everyone knows about "Septic BoB'

But I did read a simple magic post,, Its a bit like the stuff I write
on other forums,, I try and be nice here,, **curses**

I quote,,,

Again the critic stikes. They sit on their arses saying nothing , keeping their little secrets to themselves, reveling in their superior knowledge, doing nothing telling no-one.

Simply bloody magic Roy,, simply magic..
;) ;) ;)

[Roy Carman]

mmmmmmmmm that's me thinking, not often, but I do occasionally.

Tony Daly my Oirish (Irish, the people who beat the Argentinians, less said about England the better at this stage) mate has received his Innnovia....sorry Innovia, and yes you have guessed it, the darn thing does not look a bit like mine. Has totally different case.

As I go about using this receiver I have discovered a few other things which I will bring up in the very near future.

Off air yesterday due to major refit of internal earth sation.

Yours Roy.

[knucklehead]

We all know what Mr Cooper is, and now it looks like Mr Carmen is a UK version of Mr Cooper. Do we really need this bickering??Can we get back to the nice forum! Anyone else agree?

[Apsattv]

Originally posted by Roy Carman
mmmmmmmmm that's me thinking, not often, but I do occasionally.

Tony Daly my Oirish (Irish, the people who beat the Argentinians, less said about England the better at this stage) mate has received his Innnovia....sorry Innovia, and yes you have guessed it, the darn thing does not look a bit like mine. Has totally different case.


Any chance of pictures?

Let us know what those other problems? are with it.

Has the factory come up with any reason as to the different case?

As long as the guts of it and the onboard software are the same?

[Apsattv]

Originally posted by knucklehead
We all know what Mr Cooper is, and now it looks like Mr Carmen is a UK version of Mr Cooper. Do we really need this bickering??Can we get back to the nice forum! Anyone else agree?

Always has to be one person who disagrees. If anything Roys totally bought this forum to life.

He sent me a message about his setup :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

there at least 50 hand made scart cables in it and thats just getting warmed up... :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

[Roy Carman]

This would possibly only give problems to multi-receiver uses like myself.

Most other digital receivers in use in Europe, when the receiver is set into "Standby" the IF voltage is switched off.

With the three that I have tested........

The Coship sometimes does, and some times doesn't.

Innovia it stays on.

Satwork the same, voltage is active.

This causes a problem for people using such units as the Eurostar 8 way active splitter, as the live IF dictates the band and the polarity. You begin to wonder why things are not happening with other receivers, or you are getting weird results.

The same goes for the 12 volt switch voltage on Pin 8 of the Scart.

If you are like me, restricted in your mobility and use auto scart switching units, these receivers grab the line and won't let it go until you use the mains off switch.

Another thing is that these receivers use Serial Leads for the RS 232 usage, whereas most receivers in Europe use Null Modem.

Hope this helps.

This has been passed to the factory.

Yours...........Roy.

[Roy Carman]

Knucklehead by name, and Knucklehead by nature it would appear. Boring, Boring person you must be.

Thers always one who doesn't see the world as an interesting and lively place, where you are never to old to learn

If I were you mate I should imitate the Emu. Only this time use your fundemental orifice instead.

I'll go if you want me to. Your loss.

[Yalickit]

TO ALL,

I think there's been enough slanging. back to original topic please.

[bassett]

And what was the origional post.. Some know-all blow-in
shooting his mouth off about "Septic Bob"

Mean while everyone else is bowing and scraping, because some
one is using this forum as a platform for there inadaquices.. Mean while Mr Wonderfull has moved on to discribe a receiver that , no one has heard off, let alone owns.. I,m sorry Son,, But the crap your writing about is not relative here..

I did enjoy your sarcastic comments however,, Unfortunatly, they
also have no relevence,, So I suggest you promote yourself elsewhere.. Frankly I dont give a flying F****************
who you are, or who you think you are..

But if you wanna go on about "Septic Bob", you got my support,


Now what where you saying Craig... Scrap, scrap,,Bow, bow..

[Apsattv]

:mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

Basset are you not interested in the new breed of Blindsearch receievers coming out of China?

Roys tested 3 of them all 3 are easily available for anyone who cares to purchase one.

If you havn't heard of the Innovia/Co-Ship/Satworks and other units. Roys posts are your chance to findout about them

I reckon his knowledge of sat receivers and dxing would put the lot of us to shame.

[vetrun]

I agree with Yalickit. Slanging and bitching isn't what this place is about. Lets keep it clean.

vetrun

[Roy Carman]

Wow.

I love being called "Son", that is absolutely marvellous as I am a 59 year Grandfather of eight with yet another on the way.

Inadaquate?

I have been in communications since I was 15 years old and I am still learning. I served throughout the World with the British Army for 25 years rising to the rank of Senior Warrant Officer,getting seriously injured twice resulting in my having to use a wheelchair to get about.

10 years of my Military life was spent teaching both Electronic Communications and Human Communications. I introduced Closed Circuit Television to the British Army both as a training medium and also as an intelligence gathering medium.

So insults and slagging run off my back like water of the Ducks back. That brings me to Bird Watching being my third hobby, Grandchildren being my first.

It is the first time that I have had contact with the perfect person, who knows all, and doesn't consider that he needs to learn any more.

To all those who DO want to learn I shall continue using this Forum, to inform you of things that I have learned that may be of use to those who wish to learn, and to also learn myself.

I do know for a fact that there is an intention for the receivers, Innovia that is, to be sold in NZ and Australia.

The Coship, after passing that information to the Southern Hemisphere, is selling well down there.

So you can see that I am far from being inadequate.

**inappropriate comment removed by moderator**

To all you normal Guys that are out there I shall continue to report
on this excellent Forum, and look forward to your educated and measured comment.

I get these odd rants in the Northern Hemisphere as well.

Maybe I should apply the old maxim my Mother passed to me (yes I did have a Father), ...Where ignorance is bliss it is folly to be wise.

However whatever your level of input, ALL is most welcome.

Yours............Roy.

[VK4BKP]

Gentlemen please, no personal attacks. Let's all keep respect for each other.

Bash the equipment if you must but if the personal attacks continue they will be edited out.

[bassett]

**inappropriate comment removed by moderator**

As for the Chinese receivers,, We have about 40 odd web sites, and yes they will sell, one or 1000, to anyone with the cash,

How is it relevent to test something in the Northern hemisphere,
and then try and convince people that its relevent down here.

Question,,, Have you tested on PowerVu, [unencrypted]
NTSC, or S/r's over 40.000 or C-band.. I.d like to know your findings.
We are really not interested on how they perform on your Ku
multi channelled satellites. As our population will never justify
that amount of satellites,, In fact half the birds we have now are empty

**inflammatory comment removed by moderator**

[Apsattv]

Well Bassett **inappropriate comment removed by moderator** up **inappropriate comment removed by moderator** and then **inappropriate comment removed by moderator** 10 times!!!!

:D :D :D :D

The Innovias are already being used in NZ, funny enough the guy flogging the Coships has one. Also November issue of satfacts will have write up.

Now i know what you will say **inappropriate comment removed by moderator** **inappropriate comment removed by moderator** **inappropriate comment re**inappropriate comment removed by moderator**removed by moderator**

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

I am sure **inappropriate religous referral removed by moderator** will have given it a good test over the last month on all those FTA C1 channels..

Just to sign off **indecent suggestion removed by moderator**:D

[Yalickit]

well VK4 or Vetrun, you have a lot of tolerance I believe, by the way the :removed by moderator: has been spread about through the last 2 posts.

I'm not---so thread closed.

[VK4BKP]

Lol, it looks like Craig edited that last one himself. :D

[Yalickit]

closed???open????closed????open????

I'll leave this one with you VK4:D :D :D

[VK4BKP]

Sorry my internet connection is painfully slow. I just wanted to add that last bit before closing it.